I see it in all the threads. Whats the problem? Its not even fall yet, why are there no shiners.
Printable View
I see it in all the threads. Whats the problem? Its not even fall yet, why are there no shiners.
Still getting reports that ODNR is checking dealers bait tanks and if they find small walleyes in the tank the dealer loses the whole tank. The rumor is that there are so many small walleyes that the minnow boats can't find shiners without the YOY walleyes mixed in.
The comment about tiny walleye minnows may be the ticket. I've caught a dozen small eyes in the 6-9 inch size so the minnies are here too.Quote:
Originally Posted by eriedeerie
Don't they give us any credit at all? If I or anyone else finds a walleye in my bucket I'm not going to put it on the hook. I'm going to release it. DuhhhhhQuote:
Originally Posted by wakina
I found a couple in my bucket a couple weeks ago.
I am not wanting to start a pissing match but there is a reason for dumping the shiners and small walleyes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Defernaut
It is not a matter of giving any of us credit for our sportsmenship and not believing we would let them go, it is the law! The law is the law and we must all follow the rules or risk suffering the consequences.
Example~~~ If you buy shiners and get 4 scoops for 2 people to Perch fish and there would be a total of 14 small walleyes in that bait bucket and you would be checked by an ODNR Enforcement Officer. If he/she would want to see your bait as he would be already aware of the Walleye in the bait problem, he could if he wanted to, give you a citation for 14 under sized walleyes and another for each walleye over the 6 walleye per person limit. I am not saying that they would, but if you or your fishing partner would rub the Officer the wrong way and ruffel the officers feathers that officer could legally do so.
So to date my sources have told me that they have not been giving citations to the bait stores but instead have allowed them to release the mixed tank of bait and YOY walleyes back into the wild. I cannot believe they will continue to be lenient with the netters or the bait stores if they keep getting caught with small YOY walleyes in their possession. Most of the netters would not bring them in to shore if there would be a mixed net of bait and walleyes but would release them immediately.
A thoughtful discussion among adults is not a pissing match. Good thing too, because at my advanced age it would be more like a dribble match. It is inconceivable to me that anyone would be punished because random game fish fingerlings turned up in baitfish. There is the letter of the law and there is the spirit of the law. If I buy a bucket of minnows and a walleye is among them, I am in violation of the letter of the law but in no way have I willfully violated any law. The same is true of the bait dealers and the bait fishermen. If this years walleye recruitment is as good as it appears, that is wonderful but in no way should the shiner fishermen, the bait dealers or the perch fishermen be made to suffer for it. Perhaps the DNR agents could post signs at the dealers mentioning that walleye fingerlings have been mixed in with the shiners and ask that they be released carefully. Maybe thats not practical, but some allowances must be made. They cannot shut down the entire bait industry. Not even the DNR can expect the bait fishermen to sort through thousands of shiners to seperate the occasional walleye. I am finished now.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Defernaut
I did not mean to come across as a fishing scrooge, sorry about that. This whole conversation is in my opinion still based upon a rumor, a rumor that some very reliable sources has made me aware of.
With that being said I am not so sure that I would want the ODNR selectively enforcing the law as it is written, meaning it is ok to possess them now just because of their over abundance in the lakes minnow gathering areas. I don't think the ODNR wants to selectively enforce the law either as it would create problems with other enforcement measures, but are using their discretion about whether to cite or not to cite violations of the possession law. That is why they are asking/making the bait stores to dump their tanks and not issuing citations at this time. Ethical bait stores should not and would not be knowingly selling shiners with a mix of YOY Walleyes included in your bait purchase.
It is part of the fishing game and we all suffer for a very large hatch if that hatch is actually a fact. The minnow boats, bait stores and the fishermen all suffer when these naturally occurring events take place, with the netters enduring the most sufferage, the bait stores can at least get Golden Shiners to sell and we fishermen have the option to purchase them or not. With the number of reports that this is taking place, and this happened to some extent in 2003 but mostly at the net boats dock and not the stores, it would appear that this is even a better recruitment of YOY than 2003, but that is only my opinion. There are reports as far east as the Cleveland area about the abundance of YOY Walleyes in the minnow nets.
Sort of like getting a speeding ticket for 66 in a 65 if you ask me. Sure it's against the law but most would use discretion.
You have to keep in mind all the different people that are using these minnows. While you and I and probably everyone on this board would release the walleye. How many people go on a perch charter that have never even seen an emerald. Can you imagine a head boat!!! Everyone that fishes doesn't even know the difference. Who knows maybe the emerald shortage will lead us down a path that works better. ie...crawfish claws or whatever. Myself, it is more important that the walleye prosper than it is to make perch fishing easier. Just my opinion....everyones got one.
sounds like a good problem
Just wondering with shiners sometimes hard to get has anyone ever tried shrimp for perch bait on Erie? I have caught perch when fishing for catfish with shrimp.
ill be happy to cast for walleye with great and easy limits sounds like a great problem to me ill use goldies
I spoke with a wildlife officer. Because of the shortage, a lot of bait dealers are buying golden shiners from out of state. Officers are checking the dealers for invasive species (like Asian Carp). They didn't create the problem, but are working to protect our resource.
I don't know if the story about dumping a tank is factual or not. However, in my opinion, if a dealer has an over abundance of walleye in their tank, allowing the dealer to return the walleye to the lake, rather than issuing them a hefty fine would be using officer discretion. Again, just my opinion.
I've read on other threads here, and in other locations, about the problems minnow boats are having getting shiners. They can't even catch enough to pay for their gas. To me, that seems to be the root of the problem. I've never seen an exact reason. Some said poor water clarity from storms, others said the algae is causing clarity issues, and some said too many walleye (I suppose you could try to blame the wildlife people for that if you want.)
Please remember, wildlife officers have a job to protect the resource and are dedicated to their jobs, just like most of us. They are also avid hunters and anglers, just like us. When their aren't any minnows, they can't fish either. Just saying.
John
Talked to 3 net boats today face to face or their employees, Seems that the ODNR about a month or so ago was checking bait store tanks and minnow net boats at the dock for small walleyes in the mix of Emerald shiners. Now they are checking for invasive species just as you have stated. They say that they do catch a few small walleyes now from time to time but that they are easy to spot since they are mostly 3 to 4 inches long they are not catching the numbers that they were a few weeks ago due to the walleyes growing up and changing their habitat areas. The boat that services the bait store behind Wild Wings only caught about 1 gallon of shiners last night and they were sold out by 7:30 or so this morning. This is normally the time of the year that we get alot of this years Emerald Shiner YOY(PinHeads). They did not have any thoughts as to what is causing the shortage besides the points that you have already listed. In reallity I do not believe they really know what is causing the current shortage of ShinersQuote:
Originally Posted by imrsmk